tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post6953585585007200767..comments2023-09-30T10:36:23.154-05:00Comments on Accidental Historian: Questions that Could Use an AnswerGedshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15047239425466517786noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-11330721652040014002010-08-19T01:08:05.498-05:002010-08-19T01:08:05.498-05:00So... exactly how polarized can a society become b...So... exactly how polarized can a society become before it erupts into riots and civil war? My biggest worry about the economy is not for my financial security, but the fear that my malcontented neighbors will set upon each other like starving dogs.Janethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13003020514718578503noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-90674891511540904862010-08-17T19:30:02.512-05:002010-08-17T19:30:02.512-05:00Michael and Dave:
I'm beginning to fear that ...Michael and Dave:<br /><br />I'm beginning to fear that by the 2016 election we'll be looking back fondly on the good old days of 2004 when people actually put thought in to their voting process.<br /><br />David:<br /><br />Assuming they're planning far enough ahead, I strongly suspect that, assuming the Cordoba House is built, that'll be a sign to withdraw. Those Islamofascist Commie Big City Libruls just don't listen to Real Americans and should be abandoned to their fate. The right wing has a bad habit of winning no matter what side they start out on. I suppose it helps that they don't bother to acknowledge all the times they were wrong.Gedshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15047239425466517786noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-79694395801247666972010-08-17T19:12:57.010-05:002010-08-17T19:12:57.010-05:00There's a certain of the population that loves...There's a certain of the population that loves their binary oppositions, subtlety be damned! I want to think that this is a remnant of Cold War ideology, but I suspect that this thinking has been around forever, and always will be.<br /><br />It's always seemed ironic to me that, before 2001, the right had nothing but antipathy towards urban America in general and New York City in particular. I wonder if it ever pains them to think that by making such a big deal over the "mosque" issue, they are tacitly acknowledging that NYC, that new Babylon, is actually a part of this country?David Andrew Kearneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17196842122710714345noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-24308146079173039212010-08-17T18:58:09.542-05:002010-08-17T18:58:09.542-05:00Michael-
Hey, it worked 6 years ago. And as far a...Michael-<br /><br />Hey, it worked 6 years ago. And as far as I can tell, most people aren't any smarter today.The Everlasting Davehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09252574210931882076noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-697689189303169752010-08-17T14:31:33.965-05:002010-08-17T14:31:33.965-05:00I've heard at least one suggestion that it'...I've heard at least one suggestion that it's basically just a cold-blooded bit of political calculation. Basically, the current Republican politicans can't get elected on their actual positions - tax cuts for the rich! abolish Social Security! - so they gin up a genuine faux scandal to generate outrage, and try to run on that. In other words, "Don't worry about what I'll do when I'm in office, worry about those scary Muslims who want to do something *really* offensive." <br /><br />Then, of course, they trust that the electorate won't bother to check the facts, and the media won't bother to educate anybody about the actual situation. Damn the torpedos and full speed ahead! And you know what? They're probably right.<br /><br />I'm depressed just writing that.Michael Mockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06233321050691782148noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-21590067540499358322010-08-17T14:06:50.160-05:002010-08-17T14:06:50.160-05:00My comment was "if I could ask her one thing....My comment was "if I could ask her one thing." <br /><br />I failed to mention the expected response would be word salad.GailVortexnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-36570059764293190752010-08-17T13:30:01.186-05:002010-08-17T13:30:01.186-05:00PF:
And, of course, there's the problem where...PF:<br /><br />And, of course, there's the problem where, "Insisting you offer a coherent argument," is conflated with "meanness."<br /><br />DagoodS:<br /><br />Yeah, those interactions are exactly why I have a no-Facebook arguing policy. Oddly enough, though, my other Cordoba House argument came when a friend from college put up a status that basically said, "If you disagree with the building of the mosque, then you're an ignorant bigot."<br /><br />One of his friends replied with, "Then I guess I'll have to side with the ignorant bigots."<br /><br />I then posted, "Well, at least you're willing to own it." This then devolved in to basically the same conversation as the one I articulated, but no one told me I had to "be nice," precisely because we started from the understanding that the guy was siding with ignorant bigots and was wrong. Funny, that.<br /><br />Big A:<br /><br />Oddly, I wouldn't expect to get Facebook stalked on this one. And I'm still a bit surprised I de-friended the "friend" in question. But although I like my former friend just fine, I also don't care that much to see her latest pictures hanging out with some people I may or may not know and hear about whatever the hell it is she did yesterday.<br /><br />Also, when you've got two friends who don't know each other arguing and you choose to take sides in such a way where you say to one friend, "Stop it, you're being mean to my friend," well, that sets a hierarchy. And that tells me where I stand.<br /><br />Gail:<br /><br />Well, there's that, too.<br /><br />Also, I wouldn't expect an honest and coherent answer. Probably something about mama grizzlies who are also lipstick wearing bulldogs or something.Gedshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15047239425466517786noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-12356908441144468902010-08-17T12:58:59.938-05:002010-08-17T12:58:59.938-05:00Also, is it just me or is the Cordoba House thing ...<i>Also, is it just me or is the Cordoba House thing somehow worse and more contentious than anything that's come before?</i><br /><br />I think because the facts of the matter are so straight-forward and completely NOT what the Palin/Gingrich Axis of Evil are ranting about, the demagogery and the Total Journalism Fail are highlighted. <br /><br />If I could ask Sarah Palin one thing, it would be how she squares bald-faced lying with her Christianity.GailVortexnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-7673949133728463782010-08-17T12:02:11.733-05:002010-08-17T12:02:11.733-05:00About 8 months ago I had to unfriend a cousin of m...About 8 months ago I had to unfriend a cousin of mine on facebook. I liked her and enjoyed talking with her, and she and I had no problems. Unfortunately one of her facebook friends was one of those beyond-psycho homeschool her kids for jesus types. After a debate came up concerning childhood vaccinations (something she was, of course, against because some hack doctor on the internet said vaccinations were bad) she then made it a point to basically e-stalk me anytime I made a comment or had a discussion with my cousin.<br /><br />Figuring I didn't need this aggravation, I was forced to defriend my cousin because her "friend" was a total bitch.Big Ahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01534995604187556023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-54389497795504498972010-08-17T11:03:58.683-05:002010-08-17T11:03:58.683-05:00Here I was almost about to ask you to be my friend...Here I was almost about to ask you to be my friend on Facebook…Now all I see is my face in a bucket!<br /><br />The interesting thing about Facebook (to me) is how it causes culture clash. We have a group of Real Life friends, and to keep those friendships we tend to temper our statements, or be more forgiving, or engage in careful conversations.<br /><br />Then we have our internet world where we bash and fight and argue and call some unknown blogger named “Bugger” names.<br /><br />Along comes Facebook and some fellow we were friends with back in the College Age Group at church says something really…well…stupid. In Real Life we probably would ignore it (for decorum’s sake) and move on. But this is the internet. Where we disagree. And respond with argument, cites, backing and careful thought.<br /><br />I don’t know about you, but many times I have seen status updates, like on this topic, and it taunts me from the Computer screen.<br /><br />“I’m your former friend/acquaintance/golfing buddy.”<br /><i>”But this is really stupid and it deserves a response!”</i><br />“You wouldn’t say anything to me in person.”<br /><i>”But there are numerous reasons why this is utterly sun-revolves-around-earth wrong!” </i><br /><br />“Do you want me to report you to other people who you actually might care about?”<br /><i>”So pick the nicest, yet pointed argument, and leave off the name-calling.”</i><br /><br />Then I do. Then they get mad. Then I have one less friend on Facebook. (As my current total is around 65, those numbers hurt!)<br /><br />I try to be careful and avoid these interactions. But sometimes internet-me compels me.DagoodShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04557451438888314932noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-90515361382922347912010-08-17T10:12:01.735-05:002010-08-17T10:12:01.735-05:00Why is it that being perceived as “not nice” is ap...<i>Why is it that being perceived as “not nice” is apparently so much worse than being perceived as an ignorant bigot?</i><br /><br />Because once you've run out of actual, relevant arguments, all you're left with is "stop being mean to me!"PersonalFailurehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03034292023591747601noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-89339491578709623402010-08-17T09:43:25.626-05:002010-08-17T09:43:25.626-05:00Michael:
Yeah. It's not a fun way to end the...Michael:<br /><br />Yeah. It's not a fun way to end the night or start the day. Also, is it just me or is the Cordoba House thing somehow worse and more contentious than anything that's come before? It might just seem that way to me because it's a specific hot button.<br /><br />But, by the same token, this is the first case where the Tea Party types aren't trying to block a Civil Right, but actually take away a right and actually seem to have traction. That and the fact that the rhetoric is easily disprovable and I can literally come up with no excuse to honestly assess the situation and come away with any conclusion other than, "We should allow this to happen and leave it alone." It scares me that we have to have these fights.<br /><br />Chris:<br /><br />Yeah. There's that. Funny how the more history you read the more today looks like yesterday.<br /><br />The only real difference seems to be in who controls the boot and who possesses the face.Gedshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15047239425466517786noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-30725984356348570792010-08-17T09:20:30.635-05:002010-08-17T09:20:30.635-05:00In 299, then, there was a story that the Emperor t...<i>In 299, then, there was a story that the Emperor took part in a divination ceremony, but the attempts by his haruspices[3] came to naught and the Christians were blamed. These were, specifically, Manichaeans, who were connected largely to Persia.</i><br /><br />From your previous post. It occurs to me that a parallel can be found in using the actions of a dodgy, possibly heretical Muslim sect largely connected to Saudi Arabia as an excuse to try to ban the building of mainstream Masjids all over America. And so it continues.chris yhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07556240635442613879noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3375512083268389933.post-76675683587748059092010-08-17T09:16:01.057-05:002010-08-17T09:16:01.057-05:00I just put a similar response to the same topic - ...I just put a similar response to the same topic - the Mosque (community center) at (a couple of blocks from) Ground Zero, not Facebook. And almost the moment it went up, I had some crank pop by to ask if maybe the Russians would let "them" put up a mosque to "celebrate" the Beslan School Hostage Crisis.<br /><br />Really not how I wanted to start my morning...Michael Mockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06233321050691782148noreply@blogger.com